Atomic Ampli-Firebox Mark II

[sabasgr68]

For the Atomic fans here - @doc-knapp and @tobijohn come to mind first, but I know there are others -, what do you think of this new addition? Will you fall into temptation?

I´d like to try it for sure...


https://www.gearnews.com/atomic-amps-am ... ined-look/

[Chocol8]

I have an AA6 and am pretty happy with it. The new AFB2 is actually less appealing at the moment because the models are now different from the other Atomic products.

If they port the new modeling over to the AA6, then I might consider the AFB as a backup or a small and light “fly rig” alternative.

Now that it has a headphone jack, the AFB2 is going to be a great option for someone looking for a small light quiet practice rig with great amp tones and limited effects.

[sabasgr68]

I have an AA6 and am pretty happy with it. The new AFB2 is actually less appealing at the moment because the models are now different from the other Atomic products.

If they port the new modeling over to the AA6, then I might consider the AFB as a backup or a small and light “fly rig” alternative.

Now that it has a headphone jack, the AFB2 is going to be a great option for someone looking for a small light quiet practice rig with great amp tones and limited effects.

Yeah, I get what you said.

I´m totally new to this AAFs, and until I searched a little about the other models, I could see this is actually a step behind if you already have one of its other big brothers. If you don´t, this could be a nice starting point; you can certainly get good sounds out of it.

[Chocol8]

The old amp models are better than Helix IMHO and are really very good. The new ones are likely to be even better which is great! The effects and UI on the other hand are not competitive with the big boys, so it really comes down to your intended use.

If you want to keep your analog pedals and just add amp modeling, or you don’t use effects much, the AFB is really hard to beat.

[doc-knapp]

I've go the old AA3, which has slightly less memory than the AA6. The primary difference being it doesn't have the pitch shifter effect. It doesn't have 1000 amps, but who needs that many? The amps along with third party IR's gives you tones that rival the $1500-2000 amp modelers. I'm more than happy with my old unit, and won't be upgrading any time soon until the price of a quad cortex or Fractal FM3 drop by more than 50%. Take a look at the NUX MG30. There's another sub $400 modeler that will do everything the average non-professional needs to have fun. It's a good time to be a guitar player on a budget!

[sabasgr68]

Useful comments...

Yeah, there a lots of good things for us guitarists.

Although I´d like to try several options in the market, it´s not that I´m looking to buy anything as of now. I´m just curious as a cat

[andrewsrea]

I am qualifying my response in that I find this interesting, but not something that I personally would pursue. I have 6 tube amps (one that can switch from being a 1965 Twin, to a JCM600, to a '68 Plexi with a stomp on a switch), a ton of pedals and my DAW has Ampire - a very useful modeler.

That said, I can see how the Ampli-Fierbox mkII would be great for someone without all the gear I already have. Also, I like the hybrid of a 'live' performer's pedal with the ability to edit. Plus, the price point is affordable compared to say the Line 6 Helix or or a Kemper - but with comparable audio quality.

The video trailer sounded great and I suspect just like the evolution of digital studio hear, guitar emulations will continue to get better and more affordable. I remember borrowing a new MXR175 Digital Delay-Chorus-Flanger from my friends recording studio in 1983, which cost him around $900 USD (about $2500 today). It had a 41.1K / 6-bit (yes - six bit!) sample rate. Today, you'd buy this for <$100 as a glitchy nostalgic pedal! So, I think the same thing is happening with amp models.

Considering the performer again, the pedal format can be compact, rugged and transportable, which I find appealing to bigger formats (rack mount, etc.).

[Chocol8]

It’s value is definitely in portability. Take your three favorite tube amps, stick them in a pocket on your gig bag or in a case, and go. Works well with pedals, and also has an XLR out to send to FOH. It also has knobs so you can tweak the tone at a gig/practice/jam just like a real amp.

[RockYoWorld]

That said, I can see how the Ampli-Fierbox mkII would be great for someone without all the gear I already have. Also, I like the hybrid of a 'live' performer's pedal with the ability to edit. Plus, the price point is affordable compared to say the Line 6 Helix or or a Kemper - but with comparable audio quality.

The hybrid rig is exactly what I thought. I have a friend who has bought, sold, re-bought, re-sold, then re-rebought the Strymon Iridium, which is similar in concept to this. He has multiple pedal boards and many great pedals. He also has a couple good tube amps, but some gigs don't let him crank the amp enough to get the tone he wants. A pedal like this is great because he can use his usual pedals with it when he plays a gig without an amp. He really only needs one or two good amp settings and he's ready to rock.

I sent this friend the link to the Atomic Firebox. I've heard good things about Atomic and think he'd have better results with it than Strymon, but who knows.

[doc-knapp]

I have the Atomic Amplifire 3. It doesn't have close to the # of effects and amps you see in the big 4 (Kemper Fractal, Helix, and Nueral DSP) but the simple fact is you don't need them. I don't need 500 so-so amp models to choose from. Atomic has all the basic amps anyone would need such as a Plexi, 5051, Bassman, Hott Brit, etc... And the 15 amps it has all sound outstanding and easily rival the tones you get out of the big four guys at well over a grand less in cost. If you're not a professional, and just want some really beautiful amp models, then this simple rig is for you. Try it and you won't be disappointed.

[RockYoWorld]

I have the Atomic Amplifire 3. It doesn't have close to the # of effects and amps you see in the big 4 (Kemper Fractal, Helix, and Nueral DSP) but the simple fact is you don't need them. I don't need 500 so-so amp models to choose from. Atomic has all the basic amps anyone would need such as a Plexi, 5051, Bassman, Hott Brit, etc... And the 15 amps it has all sound outstanding and easily rival the tones you get out of the big four guys at well over a grand less in cost. If you're not a professional, and just want some really beautiful amp models, then this simple rig is for you. Try it and you won't be disappointed.

What's actually more important to tone on modelers is the cab IRs. So keeping it down to 15 great amp models and letting you import IRs is actually a great strategy.

Now, I have the Axe FX II XL+ and love that it has so many amp models to choose from because the last 4 years of having it has always had more things for me to discover, try, and tweak, but I think someone using an Atomic system would be doing that with real life pedals in the mix.

[doc-knapp]

LOL, I agree completely. I'd love to own a Fractal, but I just can't see myself throwing $1600-2000 on an amp since I'm not even in the realm of being a professional. I have hundreds of 3rd party Cab IR's, and yes, they make a huge difference. But sometimes having too many options is completely constipating and stifling to creativity. Anyone with an amp modeler will know what I mean. Did you ever sometimes spend 3 hours just trying to pick out which amp/cab combo you wanted for a song???

[tobijohn]

...But sometimes having too many options is completely constipating and stifling to creativity. Anyone with an amp modeler will know what I mean. Did you ever sometimes spend 3 hours just trying to pick out which amp/cab combo you wanted for a song???

I rue the day I let you talk me into picking up an A3. I was perfectly content with my Blackstar TVR ID:30, got all the tones I thought I wanted out of it. Now that I've finally got the Amplifire up and running, I haven't been to bed earlier than 2am the past couple of weeks because I'm messing around with all the possibilities. These dark circles and bags under my eyes are all your fault Eric...

[sabasgr68]

...having too many options is completely constipating and stifling to creativity. Anyone with an amp modeler will know what I mean. Did you ever sometimes spend 3 hours just trying to pick out which amp/cab combo you wanted for a song???

Totally agree.

I have only owned the Fender Mustang since I re-enter the guitar world back in 2010, and even though it has a limited umber of amp models and effects, I´ve found out that it is true. I don´t like the idea of having hundreds of amp models/effects in a modeler, I´d prefer a few good sounding examples. Most of the times I use three amps: Fender Twin Reverb, Fender SuperSonic, and the emulation of a Peavey 5150.

I´ve said here many times to boredom, I love the RP500 - even though I haven´t owned one yet -, not because of the countless amps and effects, but because of the possibility of having 5 presets on each one of the footswitchs to have a variey of sounds that would suit almost any style of playing; the acoustic simulator, and the bass simulator. I think that I would stick to 6 or 7 "presets" for almost everything.

Why you bought the Mustang, can you ask? Rightly so. I had a $100 budget at the time - and I went a little farther at $109 -, it was not enough for the RP500, and, most important, I was somewhat ignorant on the matter - and I´m paying the price now -.

So, yes, less is better.

[sabasgr68]

...But sometimes having too many options is completely constipating and stifling to creativity. Anyone with an amp modeler will know what I mean. Did you ever sometimes spend 3 hours just trying to pick out which amp/cab combo you wanted for a song???

I rue the day I let you talk me into picking up an A3. I was perfectly content with my Blackstar TVR ID:30, got all the tones I thought I wanted out of it. Now that I've finally got the Amplifire up and running, I haven't been to bed earlier than 2am the past couple of weeks because I'm messing around with all the possibilities. These dark circles and bags under my eyes are all your fault Eric...

Problem is not going to bed at 2 am, but rather, at what time do you have to wake up?

And, BTW, what kind of things do you play: known songs, your songs, or nothing in particular, just random riffs and chords?

[tobijohn]

Problem is not going to bed at 2 am, but rather, at what time do you have to wake up?

And, BTW, what kind of things do you play: known songs, your songs, or nothing in particular, just random riffs and chords?

Up at 7am, and at this point, playing just random riffs and chords...

[andrewsrea]

After reading the last few postings from @sabasgr68 , @tobijohn , @RockYoWorld & especially @doc-knapp, got me to thinking it is all about what you are trying to get out of your rig. Maybe I am oversimplifying, but my mind breaks it down to a few types of uses:

The Explorer: loves tone hunting, gets bored with a tone after a while. Needs a lot of variety from a box like this.

The Tweaker: do I really need to explain this type to AGF? Probably not!

The Classic Cover Bandito: Needs 2 to 5 classic amp sounds to do a night's work.

The Top 40 Bandito or Wedding Bandito: Needs to go from a Lawrence Welk polkas, to 50 cent in one gig. Needs 100 amp sims to get there.

The Make-it Mine player: No matter what the genre, covers or originals - this person has an amp or two and a guitar or two. Everything they play sounds like them. 'Stairway to Heaven' does not sound like Zep, but their version is awesome!

I've been squarely in the 'Make it Mine' and 'Classic Bandito' camps.

From1986 to 1988 (originals & covers), was a 1965 Epi Wilsihire and a Sholtz Sustainer into a JC120. 1989 to 1991 (originals), it was a JB Player Superstrat w/ EMGs into a wall of Marshalls. 1992 to 2002 (classic rock covers) was a 1992 PRS CE24 into my Vox-like AMI Blonde 15 w/1-12" Celestion. Occasionally with a Tube Screamer and talk-box. 2006 to 2008 (more covers), my Andrews LP into my AMI Lil Giant, again with a modded TS10 and the talk box. These were clearly my 'Make-it-Mine' days.

2009 to 2014 (even more covers): 2 or 3 nice guitars, typically including my 1974 Ibanez double-neck and occasionally an acoustic. Still into the AMI Lil Giant, but set way more clean and with a ton of pedals, plus my AMI 20 into an AMI Vibratone (Leslie effect) and a talk box. Occasionally, I'd take out the 100w AMI Mixmaster and use the '65 Twin channel and the JCM600 channel. At odd times, I'd bring out a Marshall JTM45 Offset Reissue or my 1965 Fender Vibroverb. I'd get into a groove with rotating my guitars. Now I just record and am in that 'Classic Bandito' what ever combination fits the song.

But just like the prior threads were indicating, how deep you need to get into a modeler depends on your situation.

[Chocol8]

Its funny because 10-15 years ago, the top 40/wedding bandito didn't exist. You brought 1 amp and a maybe a handful of pedals to a gig and you either tried to at least get some commonality with the tone, or you didn't bother and just played your tone or two.

The idea that you need to match the album tones for every song you cover is a modern insanity. Heck, big acts didn't do that for their own songs!

My Atomic AA6 has 128 preset slots and I use a whopping 3! One Fender clean, one Marshall crunch plus, one SLO. That's three times as many presets as any of my tube amps have, and if I can't make one of them work well enough, the problem is the player, not the amplification!

I think we can all have a little explorer/tweaker in us, and I consider it mostly a fault to squash. If you sit down to play and spend more time playing with knobs and sliders than practicing or learning a new song, you aren't getting better.

[RockYoWorld]

Maybe I am oversimplifying, but my mind breaks it down to a few types of uses:

The Explorer: loves tone hunting, gets bored with a tone after a while. Needs a lot of variety from a box like this.

The Tweaker: do I really need to explain this type to AGF? Probably not!

The Classic Cover Bandito: Needs 2 to 5 classic amp sounds to do a night's work.

The Top 40 Bandito or Wedding Bandito: Needs to go from a Lawrence Welk polkas, to 50 cent in one gig. Needs 100 amp sims to get there.

The Make-it Mine player: No matter what the genre, covers or originals - this person has an amp or two and a guitar or two. Everything they play sounds like them. 'Stairway to Heaven' does not sound like Zep, but their version is awesome!

Did you ever sometimes spend 3 hours just trying to pick out which amp/cab combo you wanted for a song???

Man, this has been a great thread that's jumped off the discussion of one modeler.

I agree with @andrewsrea on those architypes. I'm definitely mostly the "Make-it Mine player" foundation with "The Tweaker" and "Classic Cover Bandito" mixed into one. Now, I wouldn't count any of my sounds "classic," which goes into the Make-it Mine," but I definitely stick to a few main patches.

1. Main Dirty Patch: Big rock sound that is flexible enough to fit in punk, rock, and metal over various eras and can change with the guitar that's going into it.
2. Mr Clean: Sparkly, compressed clean patch that sounds great for picked arpeggios or funky rhythms.
3. Crunchy Vox AC30 patch for those in between zones. I'm not super happy with this patch, but I'm not quite sure of my target tone, which is the source of this problem
4. Crazy ambient patches. Who doesn't like making whale noises during the keyboard solo on Come Sail Away?

Funny thing is that my main musical gig is playing in a female-fronted Top 40's cover band, but my strategy is to fill pop songs with chugs and country songs with dive bombs... well every song gets dive bombs... It pairs well with our awesome keyboard player who does all the work to get HIS tones to match songs while adding tons of energy and a twist to what we do.

I would hate managing all the patches for each song and trying to match each song's sound. I don't even try to play every song 100% "correctly." I've already spent 4 years slowly working on my main patches. For my "Main Dirty Patch," look at one of the first presets I made with the Axe FX II XL+ vs the latest version. Every few months, during a slower part with no gigs (so a lot this past year), I'd sit down and see if different amp models or IR cabs improved my tone and got me closer to what I was looking for. Then add a bunch of the EQs and the multi-compressor that only engages the low end on chugs and you've got a very produced sound that still sounds raw and wild.

I like the variety of the Axe FX. I'll never use more than 5% of it, but the fact that it's all there takes away GAS. If I want a tone, I know it's in that box somewhere. I've got to go find it. The only reason why I want to upgrade to Axe FX III is because I'm maxing out the processing power on my II XL+. I'd also like to put all my main patches into 1 master patch and be able to switch without any audio dropouts.

BUT, I definitely get the appeal of simplicity and taking away choices that can distract from creativity. And for THAT, I definitely think Atomic is very attractive.

[sabasgr68]

After reading the last few postings from @sabasgr68 , @tobijohn , @RockYoWorld & especially @doc-knapp, got me to thinking it is all about what you are trying to get out of your rig. Maybe I am oversimplifying, but my mind breaks it down to a few types of uses:

The Explorer: loves tone hunting, gets bored with a tone after a while. Needs a lot of variety from a box like this.

The Tweaker: do I really need to explain this type to AGF? Probably not!

The Classic Cover Bandito: Needs 2 to 5 classic amp sounds to do a night's work.

The Top 40 Bandito or Wedding Bandito: Needs to go from a Lawrence Welk polkas, to 50 cent in one gig. Needs 100 amp sims to get there.

The Make-it Mine player: No matter what the genre, covers or originals - this person has an amp or two and a guitar or two. Everything they play sounds like them. 'Stairway to Heaven' does not sound like Zep, but their version is awesome!

I've been squarely in the 'Make it Mine' and 'Classic Bandito' camps.

From1986 to 1988 (originals & covers), was a 1965 Epi Wilsihire and a Sholtz Sustainer into a JC120. 1989 to 1991 (originals), it was a JB Player Superstrat w/ EMGs into a wall of Marshalls. 1992 to 2002 (classic rock covers) was a 1992 PRS CE24 into my Vox-like AMI Blonde 15 w/1-12" Celestion. Occasionally with a Tube Screamer and talk-box. 2006 to 2008 (more covers), my Andrews LP into my AMI Lil Giant, again with a modded TS10 and the talk box. These were clearly my 'Make-it-Mine' days.

2009 to 2014 (even more covers): 2 or 3 nice guitars, typically including my 1974 Ibanez double-neck and occasionally an acoustic. Still into the AMI Lil Giant, but set way more clean and with a ton of pedals, plus my AMI 20 into an AMI Vibratone (Leslie effect) and a talk box. Occasionally, I'd take out the 100w AMI Mixmaster and use the '65 Twin channel and the JCM600 channel. At odd times, I'd bring out a Marshall JTM45 Offset Reissue or my 1965 Fender Vibroverb. I'd get into a groove with rotating my guitars. Now I just record and am in that 'Classic Bandito' what ever combination fits the song.

But just like the prior threads were indicating, how deep you need to get into a modeler depends on your situation.

LOL This is funny

I think I´m a hybrid 40% Classic Bandito, 40% Make it Mine, 10% Tweaker and 10% Explorer , all with one amp (8 modeled amps in it) and one guitar!

I don´t need an amp, there´s no way I can crank it at home, I´m not in a band - but I wish I´d have a basement to play like in The Cavern Liverpool pub -; it´s always headphones on, so a modeler is the right choice for me, with the ability to change sounds on the fly - hence the love for the 5 switches -.

BTW, @andrewsrea , I think your list of style player needs a thread of its own with a pool option, would be funny at least. Who are you?

[Chocol8]

I would hate managing all the patches for each song and trying to match each song's sound. I don't even try to play every song 100% "correctly."

I bet no one in the audience ever cared that your tone didn;t match the record or that your playing wasn't note for note. Most probably find your version more intereting!

I like the variety of the Axe FX. I'll never use more than 5% of it, but the fact that it's all there takes away GAS. If I want a tone, I know it's in that box somewhere.

Even the Atomic has enough amp models, EQ and basic effects that it does the same for me. If you know what you are doing, and you have the right IR's, you can make it sound like many amps that it doesn't have specific models for. There are only so many real amp circuits out there and everything else is just a different flavor of the same thing. An IR and some EQ can do most of the same things a modded tone stack can. A boost stage or level adjustment in the modeler can behave like an extra gain stage in a tube amp.

Ultimately though, while its cool all that capability is there, I don't need it to sound exactly like something. I just need it to sound and feel good, and inspire me to want to keep playing. I only need a few presets to accomplish that goal no matter what mood I am in. The way I look at the other models and effects is they are there so anyone else can pick up the same device and find the 3 or 4 tones THEY need to be happy. The tweaker and explorer will likely want ax Axefx III or a Kemper, but they will never find true happiness until they stop chasing and learn to enjoy what they have.

[sabasgr68]

Man, this has been a great thread that's jumped off the discussion of one modeler.

Yeah, and I like it when it happens!

[doc-knapp]

It's starting to feel like the old forum! This is what I missed. A place where people have friendly constructive discussions about their passion for guitars. TJ, I'm so glad you finally gave the Atomic a chance. Did you ever go on the Atomic forum on facebook? There are a ton of patches to download. The one severe limitation on the Atomic is the lack of a decent sized screen and easy menu. Trying to make a custom patch on the unit's tiny screen is a pain in the ass, but when you attach it USB to your computer, the editor software is a pleasure to work with, with endless possibilities. I fall into the category of the tweaker. I admit to sometimes spending hours working on getting one tone just right. I also recommend watching Leon Todd's videos on youtube, regardless of the type of modeler you own. He gives fantastic tips on how to edit and get the most out of any modeler.

[andrewsrea]

Responding to @Chocol8 's post and I am paraphrasing: 'top 40 bands used one amp, one guitar and one or tow sounds' and 'most of the audience would not even know,' I agree. Top 40 bands that I remember from the late 1960's to the 2000's - every song sounded the same. Watered down, vanilla and pretty much lacking ambition. Kind of reminds me of 'Sexual Chocolate' in the movie 'Coming to America.'

I did pickup gigs in the late 70's (as a drummer) and again in 1985 (guitar & bass) in wedding bands and top 40 (almost the same material), which gave me $ and 'learning songs I never hear before - on the fly' chops. I recall in '85, that got old real fast. My best friend did a wedding band for 2.5 years and although he got paid like a grand a gig and really learned his theory, he said he was ready for a lobotomy towards the end.

We both say you can always tell a seasoned musician who is attending a wedding / top 40 band event, or a young kids vocal recital or beginner violin recital. The seasoned musicians are the ones whose faces are cringing in pain. I personally find it painful to hear a 'one-tone-fits-all' / watered-down band. I also have strong relative pitch, so the out of tune violins or kids signing physically makes me wince. When my wife and I would attend our kids early youth events, she would scold me and say "do you have to make those faces? Control yourself."

Back to the thread topic, it is nice that these modeling amps & pedals can deliver if you are putting your own stamp on the music, or want to cop every detail of a cover song.

[Milkman]

I heard a good quote on a podcast yesterday… “The notes are for the audience, the tone is for us”.

I’m a Bandito type. I’ve been experimenting a lot lately with my HeadRush. My current favourite setup is using the modeler (4 cable method) with my 2 channel Traynor YCS50.

Too many choice not good for tiny mind.