A Guitar And Gear Support Forum

After a bit of shipping confusion, my replacement for the first 335 I bought from AMS arrived on Friday, and it's a beauty!


Even the sides are flamey... The color isn't right in this photo, though. The sides are actually more of a dark "raspberry red" than the brown in this pic:.


And I like the headstock shape better than the Casino-style headstock they used on the Dot and previous 335 models. I don't mind it on a Casino. It's supposed to have that headstock, but this looks more appropriate for a 335:


Upon initial inspection, I could only find one small imperfection where a bit of paint leaked under the tape onto the binding on the back of the guitar:


I was willing to shrug that off, since it's on the back, and I'd barely be aware of it. Otherwise, the guitar plays great. I'm pretty sure that somebody did a set-up on it before they shipped it to me, because it was intonated, and had pretty much perfect, low action right out of the box. The fretwork is great... No sharp ends, no high frets. The pickups sound good, but not exactly what I'm looking for. I knew what to expect in that department even before I ordered this guitar. This has the "Alnico Classics", which they previously used in the 335 "Pro" model, and I had played that guitar on numerous occasions so I had already planned to replace them with a set of Pro-Buckers.

It could be that I'm just so used to single-coil pickups, but I think the Alnico Classics lack clarity. I wouldn't go so far as to say that they're "muddy", but I did have to boost the treble and roll off the bass on my amp more than usual (for humbuckers), and they don't have the "sweetness" that the Pro-Buckers have. The bridge pickup sounds a little too nasal, or "honky" for my liking, too. But where these pickups really shine is when you boost the gain and really dig in and play aggressively. It sounds thick, solid and legit when you want to rawk out, but I also play a lot of clean, articulate stuff too, and I prefer pickups with a little more sparkle for that.

Ok, so why did I say "I think" in the title? Well, everything looked cool and acceptable until I went to take photos of it for this thread, and under the bright lights, a multitude of flaws jumped out at me.

First of all, when the light is reflecting off the headstock at the right angle, you can see that this headstock also has scratches under the finish like the first one had. Also, that light discoloration on the surface is not a reflection. It's hazing in the clear-coat:


I noticed a tiny scuff in the finish down by the knobs, which probably happened during buffing. It doesn't look nearly as bad or noticeable as it does in this picture. It's actually almost invisible:


A bit more hazy ghosting in the finish on the top horn, and light vertical scratch (again, pretty much invisible unless you catch it in the light just right).


Some scuffs on the side:


There's also a lot of fine finish scratches and swirl marks on various parts of the body. If I had bought this from a store, instead of an online retailer, I would have thought they sent me a guitar that was hanging on the wall and shop-worn, but I think this came from the factory this way. Once I noticed the headstock scratches (and the intonation issue) on the first one, I stopped looking for flaws, but I have a feeling if I had put that one under the scrutiny of bright lights I would have found similar minor scuffs and scratches. Asian guitar manufacturers are having a hard time keeping up with demand since the Covid outbreak, so maybe Epiphone's QC has become a little lax when it comes to minor imperfections like these.

I've been vacillating back and forth regarding how I feel about it... I have a pretty good feeling that if I sent this back for yet another exchange (if AMS would even do that), the next one I get will probably be more of the same. On one hand, these are really minor, nearly invisible, nit-picky little flaws. You really have to be right on top of the guitar and have the light hitting it just right in order to see them (and I can buff most of that stuff out myself). Otherwise, it looks pristine and beautiful. And I can't find anything physically/mechanically wrong with it. It's built well and plays great. But on the other hand, I can't help thinking that every Agile, Squier, SX or even Harley Benton that I've bought have arrived looking untouched and flawless, and they all cost $200-$400 less than this guitar.

I'ld get my money back and either go through Sweetwater, if possible, or get to a store with enough to sample and get one that plays well and without the flaws. AMS might be receiving flawed stock to shovel out the door.
That looks generally great. But if pups arent to your liking, and it has those finish flaws, I'ld want better.

I'm picky when I buy a new guitar that is not supposed to be a B-stock or bargain basement price. Any of those that I could buff out I could probably live with having to address myself, but... That is a lot of little issues, I think I might return it.

Partscaster wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:42 pm I'ld get my money back and either go through Sweetwater, if possible, or get to a store with enough to sample and get one that plays well and without the flaws. AMS might be receiving flawed stock to shovel out the door.
That looks generally great. But if pups arent to your liking, and it has those finish flaws, I'ld want better.

BatUtilityBelt wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 6:48 pm I'm picky when I buy a new guitar that is not supposed to be a B-stock or bargain basement price. Any of those that I could buff out I could probably live with having to address myself, but... That is a lot of little issues, I think I might return it.

Well, to be completely fair, the camera makes these things look way worse than they actually are, and most of these flaws get completely lost under normal lighting conditions. It's only under the bright LEDs that I use for taking photos that render them visible at all. For example, the thing that bothered me most was the headstock, but there ain't no way to angle that thing in ordinary light to reveal what is seen in the photo above. If I'm not going to see that every time I look at it, then it's not going to bother me. This is all very nit-picky stuff... Everything (besides the tape leak) can be buffed out. In fact, I already buffed out that finish burn down by the tone knob. It took about a minute, and you can't even tell it was ever there.

I don't want to go through the hassle of exchanging this again, and nobody else has this guitar in stock. Sweetwater says they won't have any for a few months, and I imagine everybody else is in the same boat. What I will do is call AMS tomorrow, and try to get a deeper discount. They already gave me 10% off to begin with, so I don't know how much lower they'd be willing to go, but they've also had to ship this guitar three times already, so they might consider it to be in their best interest to throw me a partial refund, and avoid having to take the guitar back and ship me out another one... or give me all of my money back.

If it plays well, you have a winner. Even on my newer gibsons there are tiny things that could annoy you. plug in and play... it's gorgeous.

Mossman wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:24 pm

Partscaster wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 5:42 pm I'ld get my money back and either go through Sweetwater, if possible, or get to a store with enough to sample and get one that plays well and without the flaws. AMS might be receiving flawed stock to shovel out the door.
That looks generally great. But if pups arent to your liking, and it has those finish flaws, I'ld want better.

BatUtilityBelt wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 6:48 pm I'm picky when I buy a new guitar that is not supposed to be a B-stock or bargain basement price. Any of those that I could buff out I could probably live with having to address myself, but... That is a lot of little issues, I think I might return it.

Well, to be completely fair, the camera makes these things look way worse than they actually are, and most of these flaws get completely lost under normal lighting conditions. It's only under the bright LEDs that I use for taking photos that render them visible at all. For example, the thing that bothered me most was the headstock, but there ain't no way to angle that thing in ordinary light to reveal what is seen in the photo above. If I'm not going to see that every time I look at it, then it's not going to bother me. This is all very nit-picky stuff... Everything (besides the tape leak) can be buffed out. In fact, I already buffed out that finish burn down by the tone knob. It took about a minute, and you can't even tell it was ever there.

I don't want to go through the hassle of exchanging this again, and nobody else has this guitar in stock. Sweetwater says they won't have any for a few months, and I imagine everybody else is in the same boat. What I will do is call AMS tomorrow, and try to get a deeper discount. They already gave me 10% off to begin with, so I don't know how much lower they'd be willing to go, but they've also had to ship this guitar three times already, so they might consider it to be in their best interest to throw me a partial refund, and avoid having to take the guitar back and ship me out another one... or give me all of my money back.

So, in my opinion the pups are the pups. I wouldn't send it back because of that. But the finish imperfections are real and affect the value of the guitar. In my opinion, that's a B stock. As long as you and AMS are willing to price it accordingly (and I think I'd want more than 10% off new list, but that's up to you), and you think it's a player, keep it at the discount. I actually like shopping B stocks - those kind of finish imperfections don't bother me at all, don't affect tone/playability, but magically make the guitar a lot cheaper. My current favorite electric is a Gretsch I got a ridiculous deal on because it was a B stock.

Send it back.

aullucci wrote: ↑Mon Feb 08, 2021 10:58 am
So, in my opinion the pups are the pups. I wouldn't send it back because of that. But the finish imperfections are real and affect the value of the guitar. In my opinion, that's a B stock. As long as you and AMS are willing to price it accordingly (and I think I'd want more than 10% off new list, but that's up to you), and you think it's a player, keep it at the discount. I actually like shopping B stocks - those kind of finish imperfections don't bother me at all, don't affect tone/playability, but magically make the guitar a lot cheaper. My current favorite electric is a Gretsch I got a ridiculous deal on because it was a B stock.

Yeah, the pickups were never an issue. I knew what they sounded like, and planned to replace them before I bought the guitar. I was leaning towards keeping it and taking the partial refund, but when I called AMS, they said they'd keep sending me guitars until I'm happy, so I opted to send it back, and hope the third time's the charm. While I can get rid of most of the scuffs and scratches, I kept thinking about the tape leak on the binding, and the haze and sanding scratches under the poly that I can't fix. So off it goes again!

I think you are seeing what they consider their product currently. The bleed over on the binding I thought was fine but the scratches under the finish might really bug me. But if they dont show in most light then maybe not. Seems a pretty guitar. I have a feeling the next wont be better and maybe not as good playing.

I don't really understand that from AMS' business perspective, but if they insist on sending you new gits until one is good enough, I don't think I'd really complain. Good for you

nomadh wrote: ↑Tue Feb 09, 2021 3:32 am I think you are seeing what they consider their product currently. The bleed over on the binding I thought was fine but the scratches under the finish might really bug me. But if they dont show in most light then maybe not. Seems a pretty guitar. I have a feeling the next wont be better and maybe not as good playing.

Nah, this'll be the best one ever (ye of little faith ). I think after 2 returns, they have a vested interest in making double-damn sure that they don't send me anything to complain about.

aullucci wrote: ↑Tue Feb 09, 2021 11:35 am I don't really understand that from AMS' business perspective, but if they insist on sending you new gits until one is good enough, I don't think I'd really complain. Good for you

Yeah, you'd think there would be a limit. I straight-up asked him: "What happens if the third one has issues too? Are you just going to keep sending me another guitar? That can't be cost effective for you", and he said: "Hey, whatever it takes to make you a happy customer".

Well it would save them a heckuva lot of money if someone actually looked at the guitar before they shipped it.

OMB wrote: ↑Tue Feb 09, 2021 2:09 pm Well it would save them a heckuva lot of money if someone actually looked at the guitar before they shipped it.

In this particular instance, it sure would. But I don't think anybody inspected this third one. I still have doubts that anyone inspected the second one, but I shipped it back yesterday, and today I got a notification that the replacement has shipped (no 2-day "inspection period" like the last time), and it's coming from a different warehouse. The first two came from New Jersey, and this one is coming from Mississippi.

Ok, I received the THIRD guitar yesterday, and I'm sorry to report, it's very much like the last two... It's becoming obvious now that this is the rule, rather than the exception. All three guitars had the same pattern of sanding scratches under the finish on the headstock:


The paint lines on this one are real sloppy in parts... Here, a bit of the wood is exposed:


On the heel, someone sanded through the paint a little (that's not a reflection), and you can see more of that super-clean tape work!:


I also found a few specs of... something under the finish:


And like the last two, there are plenty of scuff marks, swirl marks and light scratches in the finish:



I'm just going to send this back and have done with it, as I have no reason to believe that whatever they send me next is going to be any better, and I've officially lost all of my enthusiasm for this guitar. It just doesn't have any "wow factor". Apart from the finish issues, it's a fine guitar, but nothing about it really knocks my socks off. It plays well, but most guitars play well these days... That's not remarkable. It sounds ok, but I was planning to swap out the pickups anyway. I think the only reason I bought the guitar in the first place was for the finish.

For a minute, I thought maybe I could exchange it for a completely different guitar, so I went to see what else AMS had to offer in the semi-hollow department, and almost everything is out of stock! I considered a Gretsch G5622... I really like the sound of those "Broadtron" pickups:


But of the two finishes available, they won't have the one I like (aged walnut) in stock for almost 2 months.


Then I saw this Ibanez AS93FM:


It's cheaper than the Epiphone by about $50, and it's better spec'd (3-piece neck, ebony fretboard), but I just don't have any real juice for either of those guitars, and I realized that the only reason I'd get one of them would be just to get something, not because I have any real desire for it. And I think it's stupid to buy something just because it's there.

It might be a good idea to refrain from buying import guitars sight-unseen for a while, until things stabilize a little. I think we're going to see a lot of less-than-stellar quality control in the guitar world as the industry rushes to catch up. It's not just in Asia, either. I heard a lot of Gibson dealers have no idea when they're going to receive their 2021 inventory. Could be next month, could be mid-summer.

Mossman wrote: ↑Tue Feb 16, 2021 10:48 pm Ok, I received the THIRD guitar yesterday, and I'm sorry to report, it's very much like the last two... It's becoming obvious now that this is the rule, rather than the exception. All three guitars had the same pattern of sanding scratches under the finish on the headstock:


headstock scratches rs.jpg


The paint lines on this one are real sloppy in parts... Here, a bit of the wood is exposed:


rough paint rs.jpg


On the heel, someone sanded through the paint a little (that's not a reflection), and you can see more of that super-clean tape work!:


sand-through rs.jpg


I also found a few specs of... something under the finish:


spec rs.jpg


And like the last two, there are plenty of scuff marks, swirl marks and light scratches in the finish:


scuffs rs.jpg

I'm just going to send this back and have done with it, as I have no reason to believe that whatever they send me next is going to be any better, and I've officially lost all of my enthusiasm for this guitar. It just doesn't have any "wow factor". Apart from the finish issues, it's a fine guitar, but nothing about it really knocks my socks off. It plays well, but most guitars play well these days... That's not remarkable. It sounds ok, but I was planning to swap out the pickups anyway. I think the only reason I bought the guitar in the first place was for the finish.

For a minute, I thought maybe I could exchange it for a completely different guitar, so I went to see what else AMS had to offer in the semi-hollow department, and almost everything is out of stock! I considered a Gretsch G5622... I really like the sound of those "Broadtron" pickups:


5622.png


But of the two finishes available, they won't have the one I like (aged walnut) in stock for almost 2 months.


Then I saw this Ibanez AS93FM:


as93fm.jpg


It's cheaper than the Epiphone by about $50, and it's better spec'd (3-piece neck, ebony fretboard), but I just don't have any real juice for either of those guitars, and I realized that the only reason I'd get one of them would be just to get something, not because I have any real desire for it. And I think it's stupid to buy something just because it's there.

It might be a good idea to refrain from buying import guitars sight-unseen for a while, until things stabilize a little. I think we're going to see a lot of less-than-stellar quality control in the guitar world as the industry rushes to catch up. It's not just in Asia, either. I heard a lot of Gibson dealers have no idea when they're going to receive their 2021 inventory. Could be next month, could be mid-summer.

That's too bad man, but you are making your right decision. If you want to buy for the sake of buying and mod'ing, you might want to jump on the Firefly bandwagon. They show a spalted maple that could be a good platform for you.
If not, just keep posting bass vid's

ID10t wrote: ↑Tue Feb 16, 2021 11:14 pm That's too bad man, but you are making your right decision. If you want to buy for the sake of buying and mod'ing, you might want to jump on the Firefly bandwagon. They show a spalted maple that could be a good platform for you.
If not, just keep posting bass vid's

Haha... So those are my options? Buy a Firefly, or just play bass? Actually, what's really funny (ironic) is; I recall when I was first talking about getting the 335 and someone (maybe it was you? ) had suggested buying a Firefly and I dismissed it, saying I probably wouldn't be satisfied with the quality, and I'd ultimately wish I had bought an Epiphone instead.

Mossman wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:13 am

ID10t wrote: ↑Tue Feb 16, 2021 11:14 pm That's too bad man, but you are making your right decision. If you want to buy for the sake of buying and mod'ing, you might want to jump on the Firefly bandwagon. They show a spalted maple that could be a good platform for you.
If not, just keep posting bass vid's

Haha... So those are my options? Buy a Firefly, or just play bass? Actually,
what's really funny (ironic) is; I recall when I was first talking about getting the 335 and someone (maybe it was you? ) had suggested buying a Firefly and I dismissed it, saying I probably wouldn't be satisfied with the quality, and I'd ultimately wish I had bought an Epiphone instead.

Ed you have so many more options. I am sure that I had not suggested the Firefly. I don't have a pony in the race, but it has been getting thin out there and I found myself checking them out. I might have suggested an AS or AM from Ibanez. I'm by no means anti Firefly. If you pay for an Epi and get FF quality, you may as well pay for the Firefly. I don't know if the bang for the buck is still close now that you have to pay for shipping.
Actually I can imagine you with an acoustic bass or a standup bass, don't know why.

I guess this is a HNNGD (Happy NO New Guitar Day), or a HNPGD (Happy New PENDING Guitar Day)

Whatever it is, I hope it works for you.

FWIW - My AS93FM was immaculate, played great and had zero issues of any kind other than it got caught up in my urge to purge. I think the Gretsch line is on top of their game as well.

My sold IBBY

Not to talk you into a gutar you're meh about , but. I have a 2004 as93 bought it used online from a pawn shop. Other than needing to adjust the truss rod and pickup height to taste nothing was really needed. You may want to swap pups as many do but its a solid model. I was lucky to get it at the price I did but would say the new price is in line with the quality assuming they're built like mine.

I am an Ibanez fanboy, and much prefer the AS93 over any Epiphone semi-hollow. I know it does not look as close to the 335, but they play well and are put together well.

ID10t wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:25 am Ed you have so many more options. I am sure that I had not suggested the Firefly. I don't have a pony in the race, but it has been getting thin out there and I found myself checking them out. I might have suggested an AS or AM from Ibanez. I'm by no means anti Firefly. If you pay for an Epi and get FF quality, you may as well pay for the Firefly. I don't know if the bang for the buck is still close now that you have to pay for shipping.
Actually I can imagine you with an acoustic bass or a standup bass, don't know why.

Oh yeah, I was just joking about that. I always consider all the options (down to a granular level) before I buy anything. Sometimes to the point of "analysis paralysis". In this case; i wasn't looking to get out as cheaply as possible, and Epiphone has been crushing it in recent years, so I thought there was no way an Epi would have the kind of issues you'd expect (and have to accept) with a Firefly, or a Grote.

In terms of acoustic basses; I've never met one that I liked. Most of them need to be amplified in order to be heard over an unplugged acoustic guitar anyway, so I never really saw the point in having one, and I've never felt the urge to play upright bass. I just don't play the types of music where an upright would be appropriate.

sabasgr68 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 11:30 am I guess this is a HNNGD (Happy NO New Guitar Day), or a HNPGD (Happy New PENDING Guitar Day)

Whatever it is, I hope it works for you.

Heheh... I started another thread called "HNGD - Happy New Guitar Disappointment". I should have stuck with that thread.

SamIV wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:09 pm I am an Ibanez fanboy, and much prefer the AS93 over any Epiphone semi-hollow. I know it does not look as close to the 335, but they play well and are put together well.

fatjack wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:22 pm Not to talk you into a gutar you're meh about , but. I have a 2004 as93 bought it used online from a pawn shop. Other than needing to adjust the truss rod and pickup height to taste nothing was really needed. You may want to swap pups as many do but its a solid model. I was lucky to get it at the price I did but would say the new price is in line with the quality assuming they're built like mine.

OMB wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 11:41 am FWIW - My AS93FM was immaculate, played great and had zero issues of any kind other than it got caught up in my urge to purge. I think the Gretsch line is on top of their game as well.

My sold IBBY

Wow, I wasn't expecting that much love for the AS93... I have to admit, my thoughts have drifted back to that guitar periodically since yesterday. I don't mind that it's such a departure from the 335 body shape. It's a good looking guitar in its own right. But I discovered it costs $100 more than I originally thought. The one I saw for $549 was a blem. I was kinda leaning towards waiting until the Gretsch came back in stock, and see how I feel about it then, but this is giving me something to think about (which is probably not such a good thing )

Ok, I went and watched a few demos/reviews of the AS93FM, and I shouldn'ta done that. I think I'm getting fished in... That guitar sounds really good from what I've heard in the videos (somebody said the pickups are the same ones they use in their high-end Japanese models), and it looks way more beautifuler than it did in the pics I've seen.

So I figured I'd call AMS and put the squeeze on them to swap me the Ibanez at an unreasonable discount (for all my trouble and frustration, ya know), but their call center was closed by then. I guess I'll have to put the squeeze on them in the morning.

Squeeze all you can. I will say 2 more things it has super 58's I wish mine did they are decent but not in the 58 class. I do have the violinburst and will say they look better in person. well flamed but not overdone and the color is very much like a well aged violin or cello.Classy with just a bit of flash.

fatjack wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 6:31 pm Squeeze all you can. I will say 2 more things it has super 58's I wish mine did they are decent but not in the 58 class. I do have the violinburst and will say they look better in person. well flamed but not overdone and the color is very much like a well aged violin or cello.Classy with just a bit of flash.

Super 58s, yeah... I knew it was Super something. I couldn't remember the number. Are the magnets A5 or A2? They sound sweet like A2s to me (and I hope they are).

It looks super swank in videos I've seen... I can only imagine it'll look better in real life. I guess it's intended to be a "jazz guitar", which are usually kinda blingy, but I like it. It's not over-done, like the Epiphone Sheraton. That guitar didn't have a single cosmetic decoration that I didn't like... I just didn't want it all on one guitar!

I just wish it didn't have gold hardware, but I think I'll get over it.