A Guitar And Gear Support Forum

Ok..I need someone to talk me down from the ledge. I sold my Blackstar 10w 6l6 tube amp and am currently using a vintage Vox Stomplab thru a tiny 10 watt desktop amp, a Caline S4. In all fairness, the damn combination sounds fantastic. I never in my wildest imagination thought one could get such heavenly tones and harmonics from such a budget rig. But there is definitely missing the oomph of more volume. I play in the morning when the AC does not need to be running and it sounds wonderful. Later in the evening when the AC is almost always on, the volume issue becomes readily apparent.

Now I have looked at a variety of bigger speaker options, assuming I could get the same tones with the Stomplab..but I know from my history that I always end up ditching my rig after awhile because I'm missing or searching for something else.. namely that vintage Fender sparkle and edge of breakup with some oomph behind it. BTW I did experience it a long time ago when I briefly owned a Vibro Champ XD ..so I know what I'm after. Unfortunately it had an unsolvable tube rattle that drove me nuts so it had to go

I have also considered getting a 5 watt Fender Vibro Champ 68 reissue, but my main reservation is two fold, 1: getting breakup at living room volume and 2: being here in Thailand I don't have any idea where I could take a tube amp for repair/ maintenance because if I'm plopping down a $grand + for an amp it's gonna be a keeper for life

Enter the Tone Master. By almost all accounts it emulates that vintage Fender goodness to a T, never any tube maintenance, and more importantly a power attenuator to play at any level of breakup with living room volumes. And to boot, I am outrageously curious as to how that Vox Stomplab would sound thru input 1 of that amp cranked.

I don't have the free cash right now (living with a Thai woman...arghh) but after some home improvements , I'm thinking this would make a great self Xmas present.

So who is gonna talk me down between now and December 25th ?

They sound good. There is a band that I see from time to time lately and both guitar players had a Blues Junior. Not the exact same amp, different years and versions but still, both Juniors. Last time I saw them one of them had gotten the Tonemaster Deluxe. To my ear listening to both side by side, the Junior was better. To the average person in the audience I am sure they was no difference. I will say this, the thing is light-weight and I ain't getting any stronger. Not sure I would spend over a grand for one.

You know it's an endless cycle and a hobby in itself to search for that elusive tone. Even when you find it, your ears tire of it and you crave a slighly different shade of it, and again and again, until you're back with what you started and it feels like the best ever again - for a while.

At some point it's really just best to stick with something and make it work for your needs, instead of getting endless new gear.

deeaa wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2024 3:07 pm You know it's an endless cycle and a hobby in itself to search for that elusive tone. Even when you find it, your ears tire of it and you crave a slighly different shade of it, and again and again, until you're back with what you started and it feels like the best ever again - for a while.

At some point it's really just best to stick with something and make it work for your needs, instead of getting endless new gear.

That's what I needed to hear, Thank you . I might still get something but at a grand$$$ perhaps the Tonemaster is over the top.

I agree, I have always had a hard time paying more than a few hundred for an amp because there are so many great tone machines out there for $300-$500. A Peavey C30 comes to mind.

I didn't know what emoji to tack on to the OP. "Thumbs-up" for a great idea? "Big eyes" for your dilemma? I chose "Confused" because you're in a tight spot.

Maybe it's the one. Maybe it isn't. $1000+ is a lot to spend on a gamble.

I went through countless amps before I traded nearly everything for my Princeton Reverb: Epiphone LP, Roland Blues Cube Hot + $500 (Man, I sure liked that Blues Cube Hot). The circumstances dictated the purchase. It was then or never.

But... I was allowed to play it for two hours before I made up my mind to pull the trigger. I've had it for five years now and don't see myself changing amps again anytime soon. It's the right amp for me.

Maybe taking the time to raise the funds will allow you to step back and really examine the pros and cons.

tlarson58 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2024 9:51 pm I didn't know what emoji to tack on to the OP. "Thumbs-up" for a great idea? "Big eyes" for your dilemma? I chose "Confused" because you're in a tight spot.

Maybe it's the one. Maybe it isn't. $1000+ is a lot to spend on a gamble.

I went through countless amps before I traded nearly everything for my Princeton Reverb: Epiphone LP, Roland Blues Cube Hot + $500 (Man, I sure liked that Blues Cube Hot). The circumstances dictated the purchase. It was then or never.

But... I was allowed to play it for two hours before I made up my mind to pull the trigger. I've had it for five years now and don't see myself changing amps again anytime soon. It's the right amp for me.

Maybe taking the time to tthe funds will allow you to step back and really examine the pros and cons.

It's funny I've been looking for a Blues Cube Hot here in Bangkok for a year now...one shop had them in stock but then later told me they sent them back to Boss as they wanted them to sell the Nextone series instead. That series seems to be a marriage of the Blues Cube and the Katana which seems to make it a jack of all trades and master of none. I have a few months to think about it...and BTW...there is a Princeton TOneMaster now too...but the price difference of only $50 bucks and they have the same attenuator, my thought is why get that when you can get the Deluxe. I'll probably end up spending the cash on the house and getting that little Vox Mini Super Beetle instead @ $400...great tones and vintage vibe as a furniture piece to boot.

I've touted modelers before, but I'll say it again, there's nothing like modelers to get great sounds today, and at any volume too.

And it's like not only modelers, but being able to tweak the sound in so many different ways besides the 'core' of the system.

Such as, I play modelers now, and I use basically three of them within a DAW host program when I play with the band, and switch between them seamlessly.

But it's not just the modeler. As an example, my lead tone's travel is like this:

Guitar into tuner and wah,

That signal into MOTU M2 soundcard

That goes into a Lenovo laptop with Ableton Live!

In Live I have a plugin on a channel soloed for rhythm tone, and for leads, it routes the signal to a bus which adds reverb and delay and a bit of compression to the sound for leads. That way, when I switch channels, the previous sound doesn't die out, delays etc continue for a while over the new choice.

That goes to the master bus, where I have a bit of EQ, a noise gate (although I have a gate in the plugin too)



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Sorry, have to split this in two on cell.

Anyway, from Live! The sound goes to an old Boss SE-50 multieffect, in stereo, which adds a very little bit of reverb - really the main thing is just to have another analog stage there, because it does round out the digital-ness a bit.

From there a split mono signal goes to a GPA-400 power amp, with resonance and presence controls, which also adds a little bit of analog color, and that sends up to 100W of power thru a single 200w Celestion FX-200 speaker for personal monitoring.

This far, everything is contained in a single 1x12" combo style box, the computer, everything and I can use only that.

But, I also have stereo outs with XLRs that go to a digital mixer, and in the mixer I add some more EQ (mostly kill off extreme lows and highs) and a wee bit of compression and another gate as well. And that gets sent to main bus, recorded on a hard drive as well as to an FX bus for a wee bit of reverb, and a stereo AUX bus, so I can have a stereo wireless IEM system where I can choose exactly what I want to hear of the band. The drums are always miked with 11 mics for instance, even at practice, and I like to put some of those to the ear monitors as well.





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So, there are so many spots where I can adjust my tone and volume level. In the end I can also send it thru 2.4kW of PA cabs and woofer, but the 100W guitar amp alone can drown the drummer with ease too.

It's great that we can play without getting the ears ringing, and whenever we play, we can also record what goes to the PA.

Just last night we were composing new songs, got four new ones getting ready, just need to learn how to play them any more.

Here's one we are working on, this is just a training recording from the mixer, we do these mainly just to remember what we were playing when we get back to it a week or two later again:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/gv6y01e2 ... fqdgj&dl=0

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deeaa wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2024 12:55 am So, there are so many spots where I can adjust my tone and volume level. In the end I can also send it thru 2.4kW of PA cabs and woofer, but the 100W guitar amp alone can drown the drummer with ease too.

It's great that we can play without getting the ears ringing, and whenever we play, we can also record what goes to the PA.

Just last night we were composing new songs, got four new ones getting ready, just need to learn how to play them any more.

Here's one we are working on, this is just a training recording from the mixer, we do these mainly just to remember what we were playing when we get back to it a week or two later again:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/gv6y01e2 ... fqdgj&dl=0

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Great tones from your setup..I didn't know you could play sound files via dropbox..very good to know

Tonray's Ghost wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2024 10:40 am I briefly owned a Vibro Champ XD ..so I know what I'm after. Unfortunately it had an unsolvable tube rattle that drove me nuts so it had to go
Screenshot_20240715_213946.jpg

I have a friend who is a brilliant player and who has OCD, who owns a Vibro Champ XD which had a tube rattle. Easily fixed with some TLC and tube dampeners.

I have another friend who frequently gigs in a country band and a 90's pop band with a Fender Tonemaster Twin and there are a ton of upsides to this series of amps. First, it sounds great especially in a band mix. It captures enough of the nuance of the real thing. I believe it has six power scaling settings, which deliver convincing tone except like all low wattage amps - is missing the speaker punishment at low volumes. Pedals work well with this series amp. And, I'd say it feels like half the weight. The price isn't bad and I've seen some used for under a grand USD.

Let us know where you end up with this decision!

andrewsrea wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2024 10:24 am

Tonray's Ghost wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2024 10:40 am I briefly owned a Vibro Champ XD ..so I know what I'm after. Unfortunately it had an unsolvable tube rattle that drove me nuts so it had to go
Screenshot_20240715_213946.jpg

I have a friend who is a brilliant player and who has OCD, who owns a Vibro Champ XD which had a tube rattle. Easily fixed with some TLC and tube dampeners.

I have another friend who frequently gigs in a country band and a 90's pop band with a Fender Tonemaster Twin and there are a ton of upsides to this series of amps. First, it sounds great especially in a band mix. It captures enough of the nuance of the real thing. I believe it has six power scaling settings, which deliver convincing tone except like all low wattage amps - is missing the speaker punishment at low volumes. Pedals work well with this series amp. And, I'd say it feels like half the weight. The price isn't bad and I've seen some used for under a grand USD.

Let us know where you end up with this decision!

Re: The Vibro Champ XD: It had a tube rattle which I largely eliminated with a new tube, however there was a certain resonant frequency that was like a sympathetic vibration when certain notes were played, and that drove me nuts ! But I have to say I have never heard a Strat sound as good with any other amp. The thing could sing !

Tonray's Ghost wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2024 7:42 pm
Re: The Vibro Champ XD: It had a tube rattle which I largely eliminated with a new tube, however there was a certain resonant frequency that was like a sympathetic vibration when certain notes were played, and that drove me nuts ! But I have to say I have never heard a Strat sound as good with any other amp. The thing could sing !

After hearing the Vibro Champ XD and how my friend plays his Strats, I agree. An undervalued amp. My only concern is if the DSP chip ever goes bad, they are obsolete.

Just when I thought I was out...they go ahead and try to drag me back in:

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/it ... 685236265/

New Open Box at $170 discount....I really wanted the Black Tolex model...but if he drops that another $150 bucks....I'm all in....watching....watching

Sh*t just got real. keep us posted.

My PR is tan. I wanted black, but the model they had was tan so I bought it. Doesn't bother me a bit.

But I wish it was black.

tlarson58 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 11:58 pm Sh*t just got real. keep us posted.

My PR is tan. I wanted black, but the model they had was tan so I bought it. Doesn't bother me a bit.

But I wish it was black.

It's more of a Jensen vs a Celestion...I think the Jensen has the more original tone. But having said that....another $150 buck down and I'm set for a Celestion...right now it's $1000 new (at current exchange rates)...@ $680...I'm all over it.

What kind of Celestion? My reissue came with a Celestion Gold. Very ice-picky.

tlarson58 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 18, 2024 11:39 pm What kind of Celestion? My reissue came with a Celestion Gold. Very ice-picky.

It has a Neodymium Creamback. I prefer the Jensen in the black model..and would rather have a Tonemaster Princeton at a discount but if buying new since there's only a $50 difference between the TM Deluxe and Princeton it's kind of a value proposition..lol

I recently heard the Neodymium Creamback and it is a nice speaker. That Tonemaster is very nice. At that price, I'd be skeptical that it is a scam. Especially in Bangkok.

andrewsrea wrote: ↑Fri Jul 19, 2024 11:14 am I recently heard the Neodymium Creamback and it is a nice speaker. That Tonemaster is very nice. At that price, I'd be skeptical that it is a scam. Especially in Bangkok.

It's only offered at a $170 discount so far..the $320 discount is my wish only. It is used, open box after all. I won't do more than $680 for it as that's what I collected from the amp and pedals I sold off.

Update: over 1 week since original posting, no movement on price. I'll give it one more week and then decide if I'll make my best price $675 offer. Currently sitting @ $840. Suspense !

Good luck!

tonebender wrote: ↑Tue Jul 23, 2024 5:57 pmGood luck!

Thanks, knowing Thai cultural sensibilities, it's unlikely they would accept $675 for an amp they bought for $1000 new. but you never know.

An AC30 2x12 just showed up for $750 this morning...ahhh...if I only had a large outbuilding and 20 acres of pasture to point it at.

Snowy White uses only 1 Vox AC30 to play Yankee Stadium Gigs...maybe a bit too much for my bedroom amp ?

Well..no drop in price yet...and quite interestingly, the new ToneMaster amps have just increased in price here in Thailand...hmmm. The Princeton and Deluxe Blalckface up about $100 and the Blonde version up $125. Hmmm...very strange...I wonder if US prices are going up or just the Thai vendors reacting to currency rates (baht is quite weak against the dollar currently) and it costs them more to buy from Fender today as opposed to a year ago.