A Guitar And Gear Support Forum

I cocked up wiring on a guitar AGAIN over the weekend, and I may just have to admit it: I am bad at wiring. I have a hard time soldering to the backs of pots (I sand and use flux), my work looks terrible, I ALWAYS screw something up....I am just getting tired of trying and failing.

Of course my late dad could reflow processors on a TV circuit board so that they would last forever, which just makes it worse.

And the guitars are cheap, so getting someone else to do it seems overpriced.

I am feeling pretty discouraged.

Fret not!
Practice on scrap whatever, old pots etc.
It will come.

A wide tip works good on the back of pots; get the spot hot, quick, and get out.
Sometimes I tin the wire(s), then get a bit more solder stuck to the wires, hold them in place against the pot with a wooden chopstick, then apply heat, and hold the wire in place with the stick until the solder solidifies.

I usually wire up and solder the pot lugs first with a narrow tip, then let the iron cool and switch to the wide tip for the back of pots work.

I use a screwdriver to hold the wires in place on the back of a pot. I have a wide tip end on the iron, and have it cranked.

That said, I might be keeping the heat on too long. I had not tried doing the lugs first -- I will give that a go.

I also have a hard time keeping the wires out of the way of the iron, so they can get melted.

Final issue -- big, meaty hands vs. 24 gauge wire.

maybe your tip is fried and needs cleaning, may just have to sand it some with sandpaper and then put it in flux and then put solder on it to re tin. clean and re tin tip every time before turning off iron so it stays tinned.
Ive never sanded pots or use flux on pots unless there was already a huge glob of solder then i sand it off on belt sander lol.
usually just a dirty tip is the issue i get if i leave iron on for hour and it gets dirty and solder wont stick. i always tin wires and pot lugs before putting together. what iron are u using i use a 40w weller iron the 30.00 cheapo works for years.
i have found that a lot of these cheapo guitars use cheapo solder that just doesnt work well if i try to resolder there solder so i use my solder over all the spots i want to solder on and it always sticks and is shiny, the crap solder is always dull color like a silver sharpie color.

i agree it isnt worth paying someone like guitar center rip off prices to solder some wires.

can always watch some youtube videos theres gods of soldering on there to watch its how i learned for sure crash and burn till u get it right.

i use some solder tools look like dental picks with chisel or slotted ends for holding wires. i have used a large alligator type clip to hold the ground wire on rear of pot so it cant move and it solders nice. if you burning wires u must be soldering it while in the guitar, i usually remove pots from guitar for easier access to the pots esp those dime size ones.
you can do it just figure out what your doing wrong, youtube is your best friend on guitar repair stuff

Perfectly natural process. You just need one hand to hold the pieces together, a second hand to hold the soldering iron, and a third hand to hold the solder. What could be more normal?

To answer couple of points:

1) my solder station is an Ayoue, and it works well, but does not have a chisel tip, and I have not found one that fits. I have a cheapy with a chisel tip that has melted a couple of pots!

2) I am often working in the guitar because there simply isn't much wire to work with. I use an old lug nut as a resting place for the pot.

3) new solder whenever I work. The old stuff is bad.

4) sadly, no room for a third hand.

5) I have watched many videos and still suck.

Another thing I run into trouble with is where multiple wires have to go to the same teensy lug. How does one deal with that? Should I add a tiny piece of wire and solder the multiple pieces to that?

Rollin Hand wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 2:01 pm I use a screwdriver to hold the wires in place on the back of a pot. I have a wide tip end on the iron, and have it cranked.

That said, I might be keeping the heat on too long. I had not tried doing the lugs first -- I will give that a go.

I also have a hard time keeping the wires out of the way of the iron, so they can get melted.

Final issue -- big, meaty hands vs. 24 gauge wire.

The metal screwdriver will absorb heat, pulling it away from the work; wouldn't hurt to try something not metal.
I have an Ayoue station as well, has worked great for 6+ years.
I bought a set of various tips somewhere that fit, don't recall where though.

I melt some insulation in traffic too sometimes; you are not alone.

Maybe the ayoue doesnt get hot enough. My hakko heats up to 790F. My work looks like crap, but its flowed and set well.

new generic tips that fit ayoue are on amazon, so the info reads. Maybe models differentiate, idk.

I have a cheap "3rd/4th hand" thing that I've always used, it has alligator clips and a little magnifier. I have a very old thin phone book that I have used to set on the body of guitars I am soldering on it grips the surface and gives a nice protective layer in case I spatter.

The helping hand thing I always connect to the shaft of the pot and lets me angle it as needed to get everything where I want it. Then I have it hold the wire in place so I am just working with the solder and iron instead. Hasn't let me down yet, but one day I want one of the ones that looks like Doctor Octopus with fully flexible arms.

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Rollin Hand wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:14 pm I cocked up wiring on a guitar AGAIN over the weekend, and I may just have to admit it: I am bad at wiring. I have a hard time soldering to the backs of pots (I sand and use flux), my work looks terrible, I ALWAYS screw something up....I am just getting tired of trying and failing.

Of course my late dad could reflow processors on a TV circuit board so that they would last forever, which just makes it worse.

And the guitars are cheap, so getting someone else to do it seems overpriced.

I am feeling pretty discouaged.

Man...I've got a clone LP Goldtop hanging on the wall that I upgraded wiring harness, Pots and Pickups in a year ago, and after re-assembly something came loose sp neck PU not working and I am so bad at soldering it has hung there unstrung for a year because I dread opening it up and trying again.

It does take practice and do not go cheap on the equipment. No one is good at soldering with a crappy solder iron.

Partscaster wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 5:57 pm Maybe the ayoue doesnt get hot enough. My hakko heats up to 790F. My work looks like crap, but its flowed and set well.

new generic tips that fit ayoue are on amazon, so the info reads. Maybe models differentiate, idk.

Yep, bought a set of those. They don't fit.

tonebender wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 8:35 pm It does take practice and do not go cheap on the equipment. No one is good at soldering with a crappy solder iron.

I figure if it gets hot enough to destroy a pot, it has enough heat. I suspect the larger issue is the user.

Here's a question: how does one solder multiple ground wires to one of the tiny lugs on an import 3-way box toggle switch. Can you just solder to the case and call it a day?

Rollin Hand wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 5:17 pm Here's a question: how does one solder multiple ground wires to one of the tiny lugs on an import 3-way box toggle switch. Can you just solder to the case and call it a day?

Any way that seems convenient. It doesn't matter where/what order ground connections are made. You can twist them together, or connect them to another ground location, or solder them in parallel to a wire that connects directly, whatever connects them all reliably.

I 1st solder all the ground wires together, did it 2x today on a 3 way lp switches, then solder it to the ground lug on switch. i always try to think a ahead on grounds being 2-4 wires together , i always solder wires all together then on lug or spot. it doesnt have to go through lug hole long as its stuck and doesnt come off after a tug.
you have soldered before its not new you just getting frustrated with it, ive been there more than once lol cussing wires for sure. i had a ground today that just say no lol had to solder it 3x to make it stick i was pissed and wtf after 2nd time . it was the dam cheapo china solder on my tip it just wouldnt stick till i got that trash off then worked great. soldering is like anything just gotta conquer it and then you have no fears.
Ive soldered 24 pots and dam storm of wires the past 3 days, you can do it just keep doin it till its right, solder wires on a bad lug 25x it will happen and you will win and say this is what i did wrong and now i can solder anything. it takes more solder than most would think to get these pretty solder spots on rear of pots like u see. wires are usually 1-2 sec on lug and there done, when lug is pre tinned and wire is pre tinned and iron tip is tinned up its real fast.

I figure you are using 60/40 lead rosin core solder , the bad stuff lol, i think is 0.8 or .032 solder im using, never use flux no reason to with rosin in solder it sticks everytime.

Don't be using the crappy no lead solder. Use real 6337 or 6040 solder from a brand name. I never use flux or tip tinners. Different solder has different amount of flux in it, 2% 3%. Military certified soldering since 1980 and I was never in the military. You will damage the pot if left on too long, get in get out. Also the shape of the tip doesn't matter as much as the thermal mass and temperature. I usually run 700- 750 but crank it up to 800-850 when soldering on the back of pots.

BatUtilityBelt wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 5:24 pm

Rollin Hand wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 5:17 pm Here's a question: how does one solder multiple ground wires to one of the tiny lugs on an import 3-way box toggle switch. Can you just solder to the case and call it a day?

Any way that seems convenient. It doesn't matter where/what order ground connections are made. You can twist them together, or connect them to another ground location, or solder them in parallel to a wire that connects directly, whatever connects them all reliably.

I did recently read mention of ground loops being a potential problem.

"A ground loop occurs when a signal ground has two or more paths to the (-) terminal of the output jack. This is most obvious when the guitar has the pots touching the shielding (a metal plate or metallic foil) and the pots are connected together with a wire soldered to the backs of the pot cases. Since the ground signal travels from pot to pot over both the wire connecting them and also over the shielding connecting them, it causes a ground loop. Ground loops can cause hum."

I must have some ground loops, as I connect the pots and have shielding that sometimes is connected, too.But things seem hum free. Its something I'll keep in mind.

Your not going to get ground loops in a guitar, there's hardly any current. You can have grounding problems or shielding problems yes. In a amplifier, yes due to higher currents. Another internet fallicy.

Good to hear.

Rollin, you might want to consider that holding down wire to a pot with a flat tip screwdriver and resting the pot on a lug nut are causing a problem. Those will both act as heat sinks and cause the iron longer to heat up the solder, potentially causing you to burn up a pot or not getting a good bond. IMHO

jtcnj wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:28 pm Fret not!
I usually wire up and solder the pot lugs first with a narrow tip, then let the iron cool and switch to the wide tip for the back of pots work.

^Great advice! I'll add that you have to remind yourself that no matter how much you may want to be finished, that you have all the time in the world to do it right. Measure twice - cut once.

Ok, decided to try wiring this damnable ting again. The volume pot was stuck on full, then there was no volume at all.

I put in a box switch because the Switchcraft was really tight against the cavity. The box switch is "interesting."

The bag: Supposed to be a chrome tip, and clearly is not. Also says it's made in China, when...
Hm.

Anywho, it was an easy install because the ground lug was much larger than the others. I tinned everything, flux on the wires before tinning, etc.

Then the wiring to the volume pot. Before: And after:
I think it looks much better, but I was VERY limited by the amount of remaining wire, hence the tight joints. And the result?

Still no sound. Grumble! Guess I'll have to get out the multimeter.

Good luck with the troubleshooting.
The green wire on the back of the pot - not a good joint.

Take the wooden stick I mentioned, push on the wire to hold it there when the solder melts.
Turn the station up to max.

put the tip at the edge of the solder so it heats the pot, not just the solder.
When the solder pools, remove the iron but hold the wire in place with the stick until the joint solidifies.
Repeat for the others.

And as has been said, wipe the tip clean before and after each repetition, tin the clean tip at the start of each repetition, then clean and tin it when the session is finished.